Roundtable 2: Applications and Standards

Facilitator: Josef Uher

Participants:

• Uwe Ewert
• Benjamin Garcia, Weber State University
• Benjamin Hill, Weber State University, MARS Center
• Jonas Schnitzer, BMW
• Gabriel Herl, Deggendorf Institute of Technology
• Anton Weiss, Deggendorf Institute of Technology
• Frank Herold, VisiConsult
• Leonardo Ruzante, Spectral Solutions

These topics were discussed over the two parts of the roundtable:

Part one

• Applications
• Standards/Standardization
• Terminology
• Terminology = Step number 1
• What kind of CT is it?
• What of the measurements we are doing?
• What are the results?
• Room for Robotic CT Methods
• Limits
• To educate users
• Etc.
• How to faster the sale?
• NDT sector was not interested – they didn´t want to take a risk
• We should talk to engineers who design it.

Uwe Ewert

• 90. Start + 15 years took have procedures, standards, security
• Industry is crucial
• New project 2000
• Accidents
• Economy
• Test measurement
• How to start?
• Inspections
• in corrosion in industry
• Medical too long process and inspection is problematic
• Process in process
• Analyses of the market
• Aerospace 2005 - 2010
• Do not talk about in public, keep it in secret
• Comparisons of the measurements (contrast and brightness)
• 2 catalogues
• Long process
• USA, Asia, Europe?
• Germany
• National committee with paid permission (Radiography)
• NDT Conference in Panama
• 5 experts from 5 countries) settles standards draft which could be submitted
• Specifications and Reports
• Standards on detectors and validation
• New test of objects
• Who will join committee? – looking for volunteers, guid for terminology, different types of robots and different requirements, qualifications
• Photocounting detectors (different qualification then robots) and their combination – hardware and data processing (software: contrasts, filters, etc.)
• Customers need the result in quality they do not care about procedure.
• Certification:
• ISO (Europe, USA do not accept ISO standards)
• ASTM
• DIN
• VDI/VDE
• IEC
• IIW (Welding)
• Watch from Institutes
• Recommendation: ISO or ASTM
• NDT standards on robots
• Extending technologies (photocounting, digital detectors) or going for a new staff, booming space industry need NDT) – focus on new standards
• Radiography and positioning, repeatably, spots, how everything works together – centre position
• Where to start and how to start
• Radalytica: Cooperation with the Police and guide and practice
• Medical detectors – requirements and parameters
• Standard for robot duty
• To transport robots to radiography

Jonas and Anton – rotation (they do not care about robots and their number), position, possible combinations,  specific car parts and how to do it (synchronisation, positions etc.)

Aerospace, USA

• How to make it faster?
• Doing robots for 15 years already, they do not have the standards.
• Certification according to a design.
• X-ray is easier to do.
• You can´t put robots under water.
• Technology has to reach a special level, they you can make standards. You need some programmes.
• How to detect the problem. Spot where to start. Feedback how to improve (Aircraft).
• Investigation approach.
• Combination of different techniques.
• Do we want to replace the old staff for new one? Question of money. Sometimes is easier to put it broken part to garbage.
• Is it good enough? Quality? For important and specifics parts of the aircraft. Is it low or is it OK?
• Manufacturing area is pretty rich.

NASA

• Manufacturing

Part two

Suggestions from the feedback

• Maximilian Linde, Porsche – free drive/free ride
• What are the benefits of the robotics/automatized techniques?
• Ewert – how about AI?
• Christian – collaborative robots minimalize crashes and it is safer – huge benefit
• There is no insurance for scanning the art
• Flexible and integrated – automatic system, simulations whole thing, etc. in a simulated environment
• Marcus, University  – size resolution and scanning efficiency, how to deal with an input in an environment.
• Proof of concept in productions. How it could be done. Nice application feel for the robots.
• XRD, XRF, diagnostic tool – how to figure out? – Robots are useful for all the methods.
• Robots on the Small objects could be useful. Some locations are critical.
• Ge Wang – interion CT. Inner ear (50 microns).
• Jason Robins – cheaper and faster robots.
• Component size vs. resolution.
• Current limitation of the technique.
• X-ray in inspection. Very expensive to build the room. To start with AI. New materials, complicated shapes. Expensive application. 25 microns specification is fine. Repeatability of the robots. New technology scan every part.
• Laser to build in. Is very useful.
• Calibration.
• Transfer of the data for a comparison with results from other methods helps.
• How often you need it?
• After developing the technology, you can see what to do with it and how to use the data.
• Aircraft runs for certain time, …
• What the customers expects? – They use the interface. Flexibility of the system and understanding. People in production prefer easy way to use it. Dedicated tools could be prepared. Laboratory system is more complicated than production. To choose from the options (optimizations). Everything is more complicated the help is needed.
• To control the process with virtual reality.
• Cooperation with the user. User feedback is needed. They will tell what they need to see.
• Composites – detecting fibres. Pretty tight. Micro CT.
• What the other methods, wouldn´t be better? Face contrast etc. Detectors (160)-Detectors could be the solution. XRD. Immaging map.
• Porosity and defects.
• Repeated tests – good and bad results. Feedbacks.
• Minimum user input. Difficult because of all the flexibility. Production and laboratory is different.
• USA doesn´t care about standards. (Different jurisdiction). EU is more conservative.

Tasks:

• Schedule an online meeting with right people.
• Gabriel starts with terminology.
• We have to invest the time.
• Robotic X-ray CT.
• Evert can give a support, but homework has to be done by expert.
• One application for example useful for robots.
• ISO and ASTM
• Work on the project.
• Travel cost.
• How to start, when to start, who is doing what?
• List of participants:
• We will distribute an invitation for a meeting.
• Who will join the first meeting?
• What methods are available and to which we will go for? Choose from the variety of options.
• We need a guidance for the modifications.
• We need to get some more clients from USA: Defence, Aerospace etc.

Notes by Josef Uher:

ISO

• There is a meeting of committee for standards
• People can join only when sent by country
• there must be 5 expert from 5 countries supporting the idea and only then a request can be sent a draft should be prepared first

ASTM or ASME or ANSI

• military accepts only ASTM and ASME
• aerospace accepts also ISO
• easy to become a member

Look on what ultrasound people did for standard

• Who will join committee?
• Where to go? ISO or ASTM
• What to standardise? (title, how we do that) … we must have terminology

Maybe we can create a guide first, part of it would be terminology, guide can define requirements on robots and detectors, software.

Idea:

• Have a test standard to measure to show what results are obtained
• iso2467
• Escalation methods … something used as method after
• Combination of methods: calibrate UT with CT … CT provides ground truth
• Complex parts require dimensional analysis is required CMM
• Preppare the terminology, but do not limit it to robots, make it a general positioning options.
• Focus on one application, CT.